http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/
Title: Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome and Klinefelter's Syndrome
Authors: Milton Diamond, PhD and Linda Ann Watson, MEd
Gender expressionInfrequently discussed in medical descriptions of KS are individuals’ concerns with gender expressions and feelings. An unknown percentage of persons who have KS experience androgynous or feminine feelings that can develop at an early age [50]. Some people who have KS consider themselves to be transgendered [50], others considered themselves to be intersexed [69], and others considered themselves to be transsexual.
One of the most noted persons who transitioned gender is Carolyn Cossey, a “James Bond girl.” She was raised as a boy, but changed to live as a girl at a young age, and became a famous model; her karyotype was found to be XXXY [70].
Wyler et al [71] found that two of nine candidates that they recommended for transsexual surgery and female hormones had KS. A host of investigators similarly reported cases of men who had KS who transitioned to live as women or who harbored aspects of gender dysphoria [72-74]. Walzer and Hurwitz [75] concluded that all of the KS patients that they saw viewed their personalities as dual male and female and wrote: “Investigators periodically report they can find no increase in sexual deviancy in patients with a chromosomal abnormality. Only too often the methods used to ascertain the presence of such a deviation. . .are not conducive to discovering it.” We know of two relevant cases; one is a mathematics professor who underwent sex reassignment surgery to live as a woman and a previous medical student who is presently in the process of transition. The frequency of gender change in KS is unknown.
Several papers have commented that homosexuality among those who had KS was not found among their subjects [46] or that the prevalence was not any different from that seen in the general population [42].
_______________________________________________________________Why do Doctors think they have the only right to choose for the rest of us?
When talking about the number of Klinefelter's Syndrome (KS or XXY) people who choose to transition and live as females, medical science doesn't know how many of us have thoroughly rejected treatment with testosterone. I would like to point out as Dr. Diamond noted above, "We know of two relevant cases; one is a mathematics professor who underwent sex reassignment surgery to live as a woman and a previous medical student who is presently in the process of transition. The frequency of gender change in KS is unknown."
Despite numerous instances of individuals whom are transsexual whom have transitioned so well that it is improbable that anyone can tell them apart from a natural born female; Despite people like myself whom have told doctors over and over, NO! I will not use Testosterone, now or ever. The medical establishment still turns a blind eye to what should be obvious, these are Doctor's they're neither stupid nor dense. Overworked perhaps. But if its obvious to us, why can't they see this?
Transsexuals are known to be possibly as many as 1 in 2000 people, and the incidence of Klinefelter's Syndrome which is any chromosomal mixtures of many X's and Y's, is 1 in 1000 people. Why can we not test transsexuals for intersex conditions, and perhaps show that half, or more than half of all Klinefelter's Syndrome "males" happen to have transitioned (many despite being assigned male and then tampered with to make sure they'd be male) to Female.
I choose Androgyny. Its my choice to make, and no one else. Others have chosen Female, and some, credibly some are still male. I would like to know what percentage of the KS population (The Whole Population Transsexuals included) are Male, Female, and Androgyny.
The omission of this fact, all the while insisting that People like me, XXY people, Klinefelter's Syndrome people, whom the Medical Establishment will immediately admit they really don't have a firm grasp on the medical pathology of the Klinefelter's Syndrome, REFUSE to admit that we are anything but male. And yet the number of XXY people who have chosen female, or Androgyny, or whom were born FEMALE (its rare for them to test females at all, but this is documented), or whom are and have chosen male is Unknown.
Let me say that again... the medical establishment admits they don't understand Klinefelter's Syndrome. But they are absolutely certain that we have to be male, even though many have chosen not to be.
By obscuring the facts the Doctor's are playing at being Gods.
I was born Androgynous...I have lived as well as I can, as God made me.
Onnineko
androgynophobia (don't know if that's a real word but whatever) is what it's all about. so many people just can't accept more than two genders, it just freaks them out to much. i'm not intersexed myself but i'm an androgynous person and i know how terrified certain people get when you suggest the possibility of more than two genders. put a scalpell in an androgynophobic persons hand and you have a catastrophy waiting to happen.
ReplyDeleteSee the problem with Testing every trans for every intersex condition, boils down to cost and is it worth it. I think it's a good idea to test everyone for intersex conditions. We even test Newborns for every genetic condition in the book. I think testing Newborns for intersex condition should be on top of it. Though the ethical questions would come up such, what do you to the child.
ReplyDeleteI have a question what happens if you add estrogen to us xxy people? do we swing compeletly female? Is it possible to have xx and such a small amount of y that you look a bit male, but am more female than male? So curious.
ReplyDeleteChrissy,
ReplyDeleteWhat happens when adding estradiol is dependent on a number of personal factors. Individuals with Klinefelter's Syndrome have a wide variance in their personal endocrine system in terms of what is "normal" for hormone levels. Some of us have a relatively higher level of testosterone, normal by doctor standards on a scale of 0-1100 ng/dl is 350-900, and even that "standard" varies a bit depending one when the doctor was trained of what materials they are using for an explanation. Now someone with Klinefelter's Syndrome has a normal range of testosterone from 0-900 on the same scale. It is probably more common that you would find someone with a testosterone level between 50-200. And in the same thought, their estradiol level on a scale of 0-400 pg/ml, normal for a female is more complex because of the cycle and the gap in post-menopause but basically normal is about 100 pg/ml; A normal male would typically have less than 55 pg/ml. Now someone with Klinefelter's Syndrome might be anywhere from 10-300 pg/ml.
Again, the levels vary, and there is no simple rule of thumb. I have talked to dozens of people with klinefelter's syndrome in an effort to describe some commonality, and what I can say is that its a mess there appears to be more going on than the endpoints in the endocrine system. The Doctor's if they are honest will tell you the same, no one knows.
Now the whole point of adding a hormone is to stave off osteoporosis, since you need a specific level of estradiol for your body to properly process calcium, used in bones.
In my experience, adding estradiol is the equivalent of taking a cocktail of testosterone and drugs to correct the damage testosterone does mentally and physically. In other words, I take a single hormone, nothing more. Those who take testosterone, while not the experience of all, most take various additional drugs to counter act problems that testosterone causes.
And then the effects, I have found nothing that I did not already have to begin with. I had breasts, without, I still have them, and no, they have not "grown". My body to fat ratio has not significantly increased, and my muscle ratio has actually increased; However, the increase in muscle mass, form like a swimmer not a body builder, is from a lower incidence of depression and more interest in participating in activities which move the body. For example, I do more hiking, skiing, and other activities that used to be just plain exhausting. The lifting of depression is perhaps the single greatest gain, and estradiol can be a powerful motivator (if you are lacking the hormone).
Cautionary point, if you have plenty of the hormone estradiol, your body/mind will let you know that this is not helping. My experience has shown that I do need it, and so estradiol works well for me.
Lastly much as I often rail against quacks, understand that I have worked with them for years and have achieved an understanding with several Doctors about Klinefelter's Syndrome as a unique set of diseases and pathologies that is individual to the person. My solution, might not work for you, but it does work for me.
Onnineko